MSNBC’s Ari Melber had an intense clash with David Schoen, grilling the former Donald Trump impeachment defense lawyer over the ex-president’s election lies.

Schoen joined Melber on Tuesday’s The Beat, during which the MSNBC host noted how many Republicans refuse to engage on the evidence presented against Trump by the January 6th Committee. As an example, Melber pointed out Bill Barr‘s testimony, describing the former attorney general as “a Republican lawyer in somewhat good standing in the party” who called out Trump’s “bullsh*t” claims the 2020 election was stolen.

Melber gravitated around the question of how does the country move forward on a factual basis, considering that the storming of the U.S. Capitol occurred because Trump’s supporters believed his false claims. Schoen answered by saying Trump “believes wholeheartedly that he wasn’t lying” about the election, but then he took issue with Melber painting him as a supposed “Republican lawyer.”

“You beckoned to me before as a ‘Republican Lawyer.’ I represented the Democratic Party,” Schoen said. That prompted Melber to correctly point out he was talking about Barr when he said that.

The debate continued pretty rigorously, reaching a "go back and look at the tape" moment.

Schoen eventually offered an argument against the "politicization of the Justice Department” after the January 6 Committee’s criminal referrals against Trump.

Not dissuaded, Melber stuck to his guns in pushing for a direct answer to his questionsaying Schoen had yet to explain “wouldn’t it be better to move forward on the truth” about the 2020 election.

It was a great interview that was more than the sum of its clash.

Former White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer took a swipe at the current holder of the job, Karine Jean-Pierre, criticizing her for bringing a binder to press briefings — somehow neglecting to remember Kayleigh McEnany’s own very memorable binder moments.

Fleischer was George W. Bush’s press secretary and is now a Fox News contributor. Anchor John Roberts Wednesday about the Biden White House “struggling to find a coherent message” on issues like border security.

During the conversation Roberts asked Fleischer about the current press secretary's "big book of answers, or big binder of answers that she brings in to the briefing room with her every day." 

"I don’t know how much of a chance she gets to look at it, because when she goes to it, it’s very often not very convincing what comes out of her mouth," said Roberts.

Fleischer said he had a big binder at first when he held the job, but eventually didn't need it anymore, and questioned KJP's level of access: "If she has to still rely on a book like that, something tells me she’s not in the meetings, so she doesn’t know, so she has to rely on what other people write for her to say."

Roberts and Fleischer name other former press secretaries, like Sean Spicer and Fox colleague Dana Perino as they spoke, but overlooked another of recent note who also happens to be a fellow Fox personality: Kayleigh McEnany. 

McEnany was appointed press secretary in April 2020, and frequently used a large binder in her briefings well after “maybe the first month." A July 2020 McEnany briefing went viral after a Reuters photographer captured an image of her binder complete with multicolored tabs.

Kind of a glaring point to just miss. Or skip.